Information - Civ 4: The List
Wonders
Wonders
-Octavian X
Introduction
The concept of the great Wonders of the World in Civ is as old as the series itself.
For years, civvers around the world have built Pyramids, Great Libraries, Magellanic Voyages, and trips to the Moon.
And, as Civ has gone from I to II to III, wonders have been added, removed, or have changed in some way.
With Civ3 came the idea of Small Wonders that each nation had the oppertunity to build individually,
further widening the effect of these great projects.
As Civ4 looms over the horizon, how will the concept of Wonders of the World evolve further?
Summary
As you can see, I'm still coming up with ideas already proposed and boiling them down into a list.
The links I have found to all threads in this forum pertaining to wonders has been included.
If you have some more links, or brand new ideas, please feel free to post them in this thread.
Related Threads
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=75460
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=106609
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=117222s=&threadid=107349
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=107895
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=111317
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=114759
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=115569
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=117740
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=117222
Table of Contents
New Wonder Ideas
Changes to Existing Wonders
New Wonder Concepts
Conclusion
The Ideas
I. New Wonder Ideas
This section goes on the idea that the concept of the ‘wonder’ in Civ will not
change from Civ3 to Civ4, that players will still accumulate production in a
race with other civs in their attempt to build a wonder. Listed at those
specific ideas for a brand new wonder.
Statue of Liberty
No so much a new wonder, but bringing back a great one from Civ2. A civ with
this wonder, in Civ2, could switch to any government type, irregardless of
possession of the prerequisite tech, with no anarchy time. In Civ2, it was
rendered mostly useless by the fact that one could switch governments without
penalty every four turns (the classic Odeo years). Arrian
Banaue Rice Terraces
Ancient - allows irrigation on hills (weak, needs more benefit, maybe cut
irrigation time or allow hills/forests/mountains to act as irrigated square for
the purposes of irrigating next to it). Solomwi
Channel Tunnel
Modern/Late Industrial - allows ground units to move across single tile straits
without ships. Solomwi
Machu Picchu
Late Ancient - allows settlement on mountains. Solomwi
Attitude/Reputation Wonders
Bring back some of the old ones from Civ2 that could modify relations with
neighbors. (Eiffel, Marco Polo, etc.) Solomi
Apian Way (Small Wonder): Originally Roman Empire, huge boon to trade
(25-50% for every city connected by it) and unit movement along its length (4
tiles instead of three like other roads).
For those who love micromanaging, the Wonder could cost a city less to
"produce," but workers would return to existing roads for an additional one or
two turns per tile, resulting in a straighter road graphic or a different color.
Building the AW from scratch would take 25% longer than normal roads. The
benefit would be only on city-to-city connecting roads, not on every city radius
tile, but it would also apply to roads to Resources and to your civ's borders in
anticipation of expansion by settlements or conquest. The benefit would continue
until replaced by Railroads (not the Tech but actual construction).
For those who despise micromanaging, give the option to pay more and have the
work magically appear when the Wonder is produced. The entire cost would then be
based upon X base plus y for so many tiles to link all cities with one road at
the time of the Wonder's completion, meaning if you add more cities while in
production, the cost continues to go up - but again, you dodge the microM.
The Round Table (Great Wonder): A la King Arthur, this would make
representative forms of government faster to discover and to implement with
shorter or nonexistent anarchy.
Lewis & Clark (SW): This would double Movement Points of all units
exploring black-out tiles, except when barbarians have been uncovered, so you'd
have to deal with them normally. Speed wouldn't be affected by another civ's
units.
Pony Express (SW): Faster communication improves Science and Culture and
would reduce corruption in far away cities on the same continent. It would also
speed up building the first Road between each city. Any additional city tiles
worked for roads would still take the normal time.
International Red Cross (GW): This would be a major diplomatic boost, as
well as better treatment for captured units and faster healing for
battle-wounded units. Recovery from disasters in your civ would be faster, and
if you "dispatched" (by Diplomatic order only, not by units) assistance to other
civs, again another diplomatic plus at first. After several turns (20? 30?) IRC
would become worldwide without needing to dispatch assistance. This could have a
Cultural benefit as well.
Hoffbrau Haus (GW?): What civ doesn't want a world famous, first class
beer hall? If it's a SW, the name could be customized to a know brew of that
nationality. The benefits would be Trade, Happiness, and Tourism. We might have
to watch out for alcoholism, though. If we want to avoid corrupting youth, skip
this one.
Labor Union (SW): Primary benefits would be [Shield Production and
Happiness [/B]. If we want to get this realistic, this improves factory life
initally, but this also would bring about the possibility of worker strikes, and
abuse of power by union bosses after basic working conditions have improved
significantly. Unrealistic wage increases (how can you justify bolt turners
getting $30 an hour?) also leads to rampant inflation. Someone suggested Wonders
with negative as well as positive repurcussions - this one qualifies.
Yellowstone Park (GW): (or another kind of national park, forest, or game
reserve - also suggested by justjake73, Thread 107895) This would aid Happiness
and Culture , minimally reduce pollution, and slightly speed up production of
ecology-related City Improvements.
Madison Avenue (SW): As the chief creator of demand for non-essential
goods, advertising is a double-edged innovation. One feature would be a Market
Research Advisor which could help your civ produce goods with higher demand
(greater market potential). Obviously for Trade benefit.
Commodity Market (SW): Have you seen those brokers in the pit?
Speculations on commodity futures adds a whole new layer of economic benefit.
This could be influenced by added production variables, such as drought,
flooding, mad cow disease, etc. Ditto for Trade benefit.
Insurance Commission (SW): Available mid-IndAge or later, a per-turn
per-city premium would repay most losses from natural disasters and some other
possible circumstances. Depending on how this is structured, you might want to
insure only the most at-risk cities, like those near volcanos, in mountains, or
on coasts or floodplains.
Sotheby's (Northeby's?) (GW): The Luxury quotient skyrockets, since it
means you have lots of prillionaires who want to pay outrageous prices. But it
might affect your diplomatic relations with less fortunate civs, so increased
charitable outreach would be expected.
Peace Corps (GW?): This could help counteract the negative international
effects of Sotheby's. If you don't build Sotheby's, it would simply improve
Diplomacy with the underdog nations who are often the least friendly because of
their jealousy - oh yes, they may smile at you in Diplomatic sessions, but only
because they know they're severely overpowered.
Mickey's Park (GW): There's only one Disney, but his vision has caused
millions of people to celebrate childhood dreams for 50 years, so it's worth
inclusion. This Wonder would be a major Happiness boost and boon for Tourism and
Trade . Firaxis would need to consider renaming to avoid copyright hassles.
Environmental Protection Agency (SW): This would aid in the battle
against early pollution by creating it in the last IndAge when things start to
get out of hand. Once built, this wonder would reduce the price of other
pollution control improvements by 10-20%, and cleanup of outbreaks would take
50% less time. Also, maintenance costs for factories and manufacturing plants
would increase because of more stringent EPA guidelines, so you have to decide
if you want to make things fast but dirty or slow but clean.
Ecumenical Conference (GW?): If the suggested multi-faith feature is
implemented, this Wonder would increase harmony between the different religions
in your civ. If other civs paid a small tribute, they could benefit from the
effects as well, essentially sending representatives to attend and bring back
new ideas and attitudes (all AI, no micromanaging). Ecumenism could be an
Advance instead. Depending on how rigid your civ's primary religion (a
player-set variable), this could help or cause more unrest.
E-Bay (GW): Trade, trade, trade! The numbers would skyrocket. Might have
to be called I-Bay or E-Auction to dodge copyright infringement, though they
should love the free publicity.
other religious wonders : There has been discussion of expanding the
Religion element of the game to include the more prominent world religions.
Under that concept, if a city or civ reaches, say, 75% population of the same
religion, additional improvements (basillicas, holy/miracle sites, pilgrimage
destinations, retreat centers) could be available, including "Wonders" like the
Vatican, Stonehenge, the Great Buddha, the Holy Mosque of Madinah, Lourdes, or
the Mayan temples at Machu Pichu, depending on the religion.
-LaDiva
II. Changes to exisiting Wonders
Again, this section goes on the idea that the concept of the wonder won’t
change. These are only suggested changes to current Civ3 wonders.
Leonardo’s Workshop
Modify it back to Civ2 - all units, no matter where, are upgraded for free.
Brent
“Between civ2 and civ3, I think civ3 had the better Leo's Workshop, except teh
upgrade price should have been made lower, maybe 1/5 normal.” lajzar
The Great Wall
“Great Wall wonder should allow your workers to build fort tile improvements
very cheaply for a set period (or set quantity of forts).” lajzar
III. New Wonder Concepts
Here’s where the real juice is at - the new ideas for Civ4 wonders. I’d like to
give individual credit, but all these ideas were well discussed, so that really
can’t be done easily.
Component Wonders
Force some wonders to be constructed in a sort of piece by piece fashion, kind
of like Civ3's spaceship. An good example is the Great Wall - it’s obvious this
wall does not exist in one city. It’s obvious that multiple localities should
labor on some projects.
Rushing Wonders
Some wonders, to some degree, should be able to be rushed in some fashion. Among
the suggested methods were the use of money, outright diversion of production
from one city to another, and the use of caravans (a la Civ2).
Double-Edged Wonders
Some wonders should incur a secondary penalty in addition to whatever benefit
that provide. An (admittedly terrible) example might be the Iron Works small
wonder - it doubles production, but it should also significantly increase
pollution.
Complex Prerequisites
Some wonders should have more prerequisites than certain buildings and techs.
For example, you won’t see a great cultural wonder like the Sistine Chapel in a
military town with no culture. Neither will you see Newton Uni. in a town with
no science output.
Natural Wonders
The Grand Canyon. The Great Coral Reef. The Amazon Rainforest. Mt. Everest.Such
are the wonders of the earth - and they should be included, somehow, in Civ4.
Perhaps they could be impleamented as they were in SMAC - simply unique
formations of the terrain placed randomly?
Task-Oriented Wonders
Probably not a good name... the concept is simple enough. When you complete a
certain goal, you get a wonder as a reward. An example might be a
transcontinental railroad, or a voyage around the world.
Conclusion
While new wonder suggestions themselves weren't numerous, ther was a push for
different type of wonders such as wonders that have extra prequisises assigned
to them, such as a requirement of pre-existing culture to build the Sistine
Chapel, etc. (See Complexd Prerequisites). All in all, people seemed fairly
happy with how wonders are currently implemented in Civ.
-Octavian X
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